A1) Hah! I hadn't encountered that or arrived at that grouping, but it jives with what I know. I've seen a few rumblings of things maybe going differently, like gullindagan drawing on some early modern stuff that predates the translation of the Eddas into English, and JMG has maybe mentioned doing a translation of Bureus, but I don't think it's very high on his list of priorities.
A2) So, you've unintentionally hit on a topic relevant to the other thread about "how to find occultists worth listening to" where I've had some ups and downs. Very brief (well, by my standards, anyway) backstory: when I first started seriously looking into magic as something to maybe actually try, rather than just something interesting to know about or mine for running D&D, I came at it from a full-on materialist "this is all just archetypes and depth psychology" perspective. I didn't find chaos magic appealing, as I had enough respect for the non-obvious selective powers of tradition to arrive at better/more meaningful/more effective ways of interacting with these archetypes than purely individually-significant symbols, but metaphysically I assumed it was all arbitrary. Also relevant: for most of my caring-about-politics life, I've been pretty far into the anarcho-capitalist flavor of Libertarianism, which I bring up due to what that can tell you about my default take on individualism and authority. In this way of looking at magic, Temple of Set and/or broader LHP, heck even The Church of Satan to some degree, all made a certain amount of sense.
Well, then I read some JMG, I decided to give "actually believing in the Gods and spirits" a try, and some very weird, but very good stuff happened for me. So now I was in a position where a) I believed that spiritual entities called upon in ritual are actual conscious beings that can really influence my life, so I better be careful which ones I talk to, b) actual "worship" of deities, as opposed to just trying to manifest them in your own life made certain sense, and c) folks who had seemingly steered me well (like JMG and his commentariat) had a default negative assessment of LHP groups, practitioners, and philosophies. Oh, and add to this that I was starting to more seriously question the kind of "do what thou wilt" individualism that libertarianism and LHP spiritual paths seemed to share (without looking too deeply into them, of course).
Anyhow, where all of this has gotten me (for now) is that anything LHP should be approached with caution, not necessarily because it is eeeevilll, but precisely because some of what might be most attractive about it to me and my predispositions might be the very stuff that I need to think harder about. An analogy: I managed to make it through school without getting into adderall or other "uppers" beyond coffee, but in the Army, I discovered I had quite the taste for caffeine and tobacco. This makes me think I should probably stay the hell away from harder stimulants, even if some folks find them harmless or even helpful in some contexts.
So, I will likely add Webb and other LHP people who seem reasonable to my reading lists, but I'll be a little more careful around trying out their practices (not that I'll be in the market for new daily practices anytime soon!)
B1) Yeah, this is definitely an element of the myths where I feel like I'm really missing something important. A few Magic Mondays ago, I asked for any resources on "giants" from other Indo-European sources, in part because I think I might have to sneak up on this question to start really getting it. As for female Asynjur with male jotnar, hmmm - you get a lot of jotnar lusting after Freyja, but not consummating, I've always assumed there was at least a lust element in Thjazi taking Idhunn, if not something more (especially if it's a cognate myth with Hades & Persephone, which somehow totally escaped me as a possibility until the last few months when someone else pointed it out), and you get some funky edge cases like Loki as the mare and the fact that Ran and Aegir are kinda-sorta jotnar but also not?
B2) Yeah, the whole "bringer of the secret fire"/"maker of the first sacrifice"/"morally ambiguous trickery for greater good" angle of Odin is one that I am interested in exploring more deeply, especially as some comparative IE myth/religion stuff I've encountered recently has made some connections I didn't think/know to expect. I feel like this whole angle, especially the degree to which it is "left hand", is also linked up with Odin's relationship with Loki, and Loki's roles in the myths at all. Short version of where my suspicions point: Jordan Peterson has praised Christianity's model of evil and how it works psychologically, as represented mythically, and I suspect that Germanic myth has some very useful insights here, especially as regards the ambivalence of "the rationa intellect" as a part of consciousness.
B3) Aww, it looks like a "joke via quiz" didn't go through, maybe it got eaten by dreamwidth security settings?
no subject
A2) So, you've unintentionally hit on a topic relevant to the other thread about "how to find occultists worth listening to" where I've had some ups and downs. Very brief (well, by my standards, anyway) backstory: when I first started seriously looking into magic as something to maybe actually try, rather than just something interesting to know about or mine for running D&D, I came at it from a full-on materialist "this is all just archetypes and depth psychology" perspective. I didn't find chaos magic appealing, as I had enough respect for the non-obvious selective powers of tradition to arrive at better/more meaningful/more effective ways of interacting with these archetypes than purely individually-significant symbols, but metaphysically I assumed it was all arbitrary. Also relevant: for most of my caring-about-politics life, I've been pretty far into the anarcho-capitalist flavor of Libertarianism, which I bring up due to what that can tell you about my default take on individualism and authority. In this way of looking at magic, Temple of Set and/or broader LHP, heck even The Church of Satan to some degree, all made a certain amount of sense.
Well, then I read some JMG, I decided to give "actually believing in the Gods and spirits" a try, and some very weird, but very good stuff happened for me. So now I was in a position where a) I believed that spiritual entities called upon in ritual are actual conscious beings that can really influence my life, so I better be careful which ones I talk to, b) actual "worship" of deities, as opposed to just trying to manifest them in your own life made certain sense, and c) folks who had seemingly steered me well (like JMG and his commentariat) had a default negative assessment of LHP groups, practitioners, and philosophies. Oh, and add to this that I was starting to more seriously question the kind of "do what thou wilt" individualism that libertarianism and LHP spiritual paths seemed to share (without looking too deeply into them, of course).
Anyhow, where all of this has gotten me (for now) is that anything LHP should be approached with caution, not necessarily because it is eeeevilll, but precisely because some of what might be most attractive about it to me and my predispositions might be the very stuff that I need to think harder about. An analogy: I managed to make it through school without getting into adderall or other "uppers" beyond coffee, but in the Army, I discovered I had quite the taste for caffeine and tobacco. This makes me think I should probably stay the hell away from harder stimulants, even if some folks find them harmless or even helpful in some contexts.
So, I will likely add Webb and other LHP people who seem reasonable to my reading lists, but I'll be a little more careful around trying out their practices (not that I'll be in the market for new daily practices anytime soon!)
B1) Yeah, this is definitely an element of the myths where I feel like I'm really missing something important. A few Magic Mondays ago, I asked for any resources on "giants" from other Indo-European sources, in part because I think I might have to sneak up on this question to start really getting it. As for female Asynjur with male jotnar, hmmm - you get a lot of jotnar lusting after Freyja, but not consummating, I've always assumed there was at least a lust element in Thjazi taking Idhunn, if not something more (especially if it's a cognate myth with Hades & Persephone, which somehow totally escaped me as a possibility until the last few months when someone else pointed it out), and you get some funky edge cases like Loki as the mare and the fact that Ran and Aegir are kinda-sorta jotnar but also not?
B2) Yeah, the whole "bringer of the secret fire"/"maker of the first sacrifice"/"morally ambiguous trickery for greater good" angle of Odin is one that I am interested in exploring more deeply, especially as some comparative IE myth/religion stuff I've encountered recently has made some connections I didn't think/know to expect. I feel like this whole angle, especially the degree to which it is "left hand", is also linked up with Odin's relationship with Loki, and Loki's roles in the myths at all. Short version of where my suspicions point: Jordan Peterson has praised Christianity's model of evil and how it works psychologically, as represented mythically, and I suspect that Germanic myth has some very useful insights here, especially as regards the ambivalence of "the rationa intellect" as a part of consciousness.
B3) Aww, it looks like a "joke via quiz" didn't go through, maybe it got eaten by dreamwidth security settings?