[Open Post] Heathen Open Post

[jprussell]

Howdy,

So, I'm looking to strengthen some connections among Ecosophia-adjacent Heathens, and an easy first step seemed to be a regular open post here on my dreamwidth.

A few ground rules:

1. The overall goal here is for folks interested in Heathenry to meet, share resources, and so forth. So, even though I won't draw a hard line on "on-topic" against "off-topic," it would be best if posts have something to do with Germanic/Northern European polytheism, whether ancient or modern.


2. Let's keep things civil. Disagreement is welcome, but insults, rudeness, and attacks are not.


3. I don't expect enough traffic to need to put a hard limit on when this post will be open, but once the next open post goes up, please post any new discussions there.

Otherwise, welcome, and kindly say hello!

Comments

[jprussell]

To get things going, I figured I'd (re-)introduce myself:

Hi, I'm Jeff! I've spelled out my spiritual journey in some detail before, but the short version is that I grew up a lukewarm Christian, got a bit more serious in college, then slipped into materialist agnoticism/atheism for a while before discovering occultism and magic and finding my spiritual home in Heathenry.

I'm at the "harder" end of polytheism, seeing different Gods and Goddesses as genuinely distinct Beings/personalities, though I tend to assume that most of the names different Germanic languages refer to the same Being (for example, I tend to assume Odhinn, Woden, Wotan, *Wodhanaz are all "the same God"), and my working metaphysical hypothesis is something like Hermetic-flavored Platonism - all those distinct personalities might be "emanations" of a unified source of consciousness/Being, but I think the distinctness matters here at the human level.

More specific to Heathenry, here's where I fall on some of the "doctrinal" fault lines:

I'm open to the idea that ancestry might have some relevance to practice, but I don't begrudge folks of non-Northern-European extraction worshipping the Germanic Gods, so I somewhat uncomfortably straddle the "folkish" vs "universalist" line, which so far hasn't been too much of an issue, since I haven't tried to participate in any groups.

I believe the "giants" (jotnar, ettins, thurses, whatever) are real and powerful spiritual forces, but am very wary of offering them worship, and tend to stick only to those with some place in the camps of the Aesir or the Vanir - for example, for His mentoring of Woden, I include Meomer (Mimir) in my practice, and I would consider Skadhi reasonable to worship, though I don't have a relationship with Her, but I wouldn't offer worship to Thjazi. This is more based in caution than any hard theological rule, and I'm open to experience changing my mind here.

Similarly, I think that Loki is and ought to be treated fully as a God, but I don't personally offer Him any worship - I talk about Him with respect and have no problem with those who worship Him, but I don't have a relationship and I'm a bit leery of building one, given His rather ambivalent nature in the lore.

My own practice is centered around Anglo-Saxon names and what little we know of their culture and practice, but I tend to happily accept the Old Norse stories as fully relevant and useful, since, as I mentioned, I tend to regard "cognate Gods" within the Germanic traditions as likely "the same" - Woden is Odhinn is *Wodhanaz, and so stories about Him hanging on the Tree, winning the Runes, and so forth are likely just as relevant in a more-or-less Anglo-Saxon context as a more purely Norse one. This is mostly for aesthetic reasons - I like the sound and feel of Old English, and I feel more cultural affinity with the English, old and new, than I do with the Nordic countries and their peoples.

Where things get a bit weirder is that I also currently follow the path of Revival Druidry and its magic as laid out in John Michael Greer's book's The Druid Magic Handbook and The Dolmen Arch. I've also supplemented these with some work in the Modern Order of Essenes and Universal Gnostic Church traditions, so you could say I'm far from a "purist." In my own work, I've found all of these to harmonize fairly well by calling upon Germanic Gods in the various work (for example, I call upon Idun when doing the MOE work, and upon Woden, Baldaeg, Frigg, Eostre, Frige, Ing, Idun, Erce, and Tiw during the SOP).

If you'd like to get a feel for some of the sources I've found helpful, I've put together this annotated book list on works relevant to Heathenry: https://jpowellrussell.com/#list_of_books_on_germanish_belief_with_thoughts

Anyhow, looking forward to hearing from others, and once again, welcome!
Jeff

[(Anonymous)]

What's the Germanic equivalent of Saturn? I hope we can someday rename "Saturday" so it isn't tainted by the Roman pantheon.

[(Anonymous)]

On the North American continent, where do you think the extent of the Germanic pantheon's influence is? How far south and west can you go before the Germanic pantheon yields way to the Mesoamerican pantheon?

Introduction

[borealbear]

Hey, thank you for doing this, and hope to see a good cross-section of Heathen JMG readers here. A brief introduction from me as well: I'm Norwegian, late thirties, used to be a Dawkins-style materialist in my twenties, but have somehow found my way into esotericism and even religion in no small part due to reading JMG for a decade and change. Hope you don't mind that I'd rather not share my real name, but dogmatic materialism is still the order of the day in my circles, and I'd prefer if people I know in real life don't know I'm involved in these kinds of practices. At least not for a good while yet.

Anyway, even while I was an atheist, I always had a lot of affection for the Norse/Germanic Gods and thought it would have been awesome if they actually existed and could be worshipped. It just felt like wishful thinking to me. I eventually decided to give ceremonial magic a try, since it seemed like a beautiful artform in itself and also something I could really use to change my life for the better, and religion sort of followed from that.

In terms of esoteric practice I've followed a similar path to our host Jeff in many ways: started with JMG and Sven Eriksen's old Heathen Golden Dawn rituals, then went on to various Druid Revival practices for a while when the full HDG system didn't materialize. While I have a lot of respect and sympathy for the Druid Revival, though, I've always felt more comfortable with Germanic than Celtic myth and Gods. And so when Isaac Hill's new HDG finally came out, I gave it a try for old time's sake and had what I can only call a significant experience, which combined with divination led to me to believe I should follow this path. That was last August, and by now I'm both working on finishing up the first grade of the HDG and trying to feel my way into a Heathen religious practice that feels right and makes sense, even if my atheist baggage still makes it awkward sometimes. (As an aside, I'll admit I've been falling a bit behind with the Heathen Rosary project and concentrated on the GD stuff, but I do absolutely intend to get back to it and write up some prayers.)

As for the folkish vs universalist conflict, I agree that trying to gatekeep religious practice by ethnicity seems both silly and petty. Isn't that a matter between the individual and the Gods? Who am I to make myself judge of that? And of course we do have a real problem with racists in our midst. That said...sometimes it's hard not to feel the knee-jerk sniping at those oh so evilly evil "folkists" is another strand of politically correct American Team Blue-style posturing too. Especially in places like Heathen Reddit, where there anything that's remotely "folkish" is immediately banished as wrongthink.

Or in other words: I support the right of individual groups to decide who they want to admit, and I do think there's a difference between actual straight-up racists (ie. people who sincerely believe white skin or European ancestry makes someone more moral or intelligent) and people who don't feel non-European people are inferior in any way but simply want their own ethnic religion. I think the main problem for me is when they link it to skin color, which is so abitrary. And of course many of these people tend to be Americans with little to no direct connection to Scandinavian culture anyway, not to mention how present-day Scandinavian culture has very little in common with the Norse era to begin with. So I suppose like most things, it's complicated.

In terms of aspects of Gods, I don't have any strong feelings, other than one: I personally strongly prefer to view Freya and Frigg(a) as distinct Goddesses. Maybe because I identify much more with the things Frigg represents and would feel more inclined to worship Her than Freya.

Finally, I'm considering traveling to the public blot at Gamla Uppsala in Sweden, which is only about five hour's drive from where I live. I've never met any actual practicing Heathens in real life, so could be interesting. Do any of you have experiences with events like this?

[sdi]

Hey Jeff! As you know, I'm not a heathen, but as you also know, I'm not not a heathen trying to sort out Diodoros's suggestion that maybe I am and I just don't know it.

It's been a long time (a bit over a decade, I think?) since I've read the Eddas, but I seem to recall that Snorri Sturluson considered Asgard to be Troy. I don't take the notion that any of this stuff is historical very seriously, but on the philosophical side, at least, the symbolic equivalences are certainly plausible and have a lot to recommend them.

I'm gonna need to sit myself down and re-read the Gylfaginning one of these days, but I was wondering if you knew of anyone else who's dug into the matter at all? I'm very ignorant of whether the heathen community at large has any interest in the notion.

On the yearly boast

[andrewskeen]

Hi Jeff,

Here's an interesting yearly boast experience you might appreciate. I've been doing them for the past few years, very effective. Texas has (as of this morning possibly had) this odd loophole which made THC-A and derivatives legal; the low cost and ease-of-access proved too much, I become a complete lotus-eater when stoned, so my boast heading into calendar year 2024 was no more. That worked out great, and was quite effortless as well, something about "no, I'm under a vow" made it trivial not to indulge.

Fast forward to late Jan: "ah it's not a big deal, I can handle it, plus I'm no longer under a vow", which had an entirely predictable result. (I wish I could attach images because my rolling average weight tracking graph shows a neat 10lbs gain through mid-Feb, when I injured myself lifting.) And thanks to the magic of modern e-commerce, I got the astrological chart for the precise time I first bought myself a gram.

That matches my natal ascendant within about 10° but the really fascinating part is the Moon is transiting my natal Saturn: with Cancer on the 12th, the Moon accidentally signifies self-undoing, quite sensible that her own difficulty (fallen in Scorpio in the chart) and in the via combusta (15 Libra-15 Scorpio) would damage an already fraught natal Saturn placement, leading to the dissolution of bonds which should be in place (natural signification of Saturn) and eventual physical injury (Saturn's rulership of my natal 6th, house of illness and injury). Plus the very malignant Mars (afflicted in my nativity) there in the chart's 12th. Pretty cool (at least in retrospect).

Anyway I made a similar boast/vow at the start of the astrological new year and things have been going quite well in this domain since. So I like this practice, even for those who aren't technically heathens or are just heathen-adjacent.

Best,
Andrew

[open_space]

Howdy!

I hope all is well.

Odin has been trying to grab my attention this last week and I was wondering if, 1) you had a relationship with him and would mind sharing what has been your experience and how does him feel to you and 2) If you had any book(s) or sources that you would recommend.

Thanks in advance and may you be well!